Just so we keep the Russia Story on the Front Burner... until the real culprits are cooked!


#61

Do you all want to keep defending sweet and innocent Don Jr?


#62

Great. I don’t think Trump Jr is guilty of treason or anything, but why is this dude not just being straight up and honest from the start?

If this is all confirmed to be true, he is just giving people like @FiredUpDem ammo on the Russia shit.


#63

Don’t fall for it. This is also a nothingburger. Do your research before replying @Alfredo never concede a point to @FiredUpDem without getting all the facts. They want everyone distracted and reacting to their screeching. Don’t do it.


#64

Precisely… I certainly didn’t see the information that you posted but in all of the screeching posted by @FiredUpDem, after looking at several pieces of information was the best they could do is call him a former Russian counterintellegence officer turned LOBBYIST… If he is properly registered as a lobbyist in the US, it shouldn’t matter who he meets with… Either the left likes the globalist world they are helping to foist on people, or they don’t…


#65

A lobbyist with a long track record of meeting with DEMOCRATS sympathetic to Russian causes.


#66

They like it fine for themselves however it doesn’t apply to the GOP.

Some would call it a double standard.

Some would call them hypocrites.


#67

The Code of Federal Regulations makes the law immunizing Trump Jr.’s actions precisely clear: any foreign national individual may volunteer personal services to a federal candidate or federal political committee without making a contribution. The law provides this volunteer “exemption” as long as the individual performing the service is not compensated by anyone on the campaign. See 11 CFR 100.74. For example, as the Federal Election Commission advises all, “an individual can provide volunteer services to a candidate or party without considering the value of those service a contribution to the candidate or party.” Section 30121 of Title 52 does not apply to voluntary activity or services. The thing “of value” must be actual money, or its transferable equivalent, not a volunteer of services or information. Otherwise, if volunteering information in coordination with a campaign constituted donations, everyone from John Harwood to Chuck Todd (and maybe all of CNN) made millions in donations to the Hillary campaign, as WikiLeaks emails disclosed.

Hence, legally, Donald Trump Jr. taking a meeting at the request of a family friend, to hear someone wanting to volunteer information about your Dad’s adversary, can legally be no crime.

Panties still in a twist???


#68

Looks like dossiers dude has been spooked…


#69

The initial exchange of e-mails arranging the 6/9/16 meeting was on 6/3/16. Trump’s tweet of 6/7/16 promised that he would give a major speech on 6/13/16 about newly hacked Clinton e-mails. The existence of the hack, and the possession of the hacked material by WikiLeaks, was announced on 6/12/16 by Assange, and on 6/14/16 by the WaPo. The fact that Trump announced something on 6/7, if only in a way that no one took literally before 6/12, was noted at the time, but not thought to mean that Trump was himself involved in the hack. That would have been way too conspiracy theory at that time, given our much more limited knowledge of Trump back in June of 2016. It was just assumed at that time that WaPo and perhaps other news outlets had at least preliminary word on the DNC hack, and that got out to Trump a week before WaPo, bolstered by Assange’s announcement two days before it ran the story, felt it had firm enough grounds to publish.

But now we know how Trump became aware of the coming publication of hacked DNC material. His son had, on 6/3/16, arranged a meeting to negotiate acquisition and/or exploitation of this material with Veselnitskaya and Akhmetshin. Then Trump’s tweet on the day of the meeting itself, written just after that meeting, makes two cryptic points, well, cryptic to those of us not in on his strategy at the time, but perfectly understandable now that we know about the 6/9/16 meeting in particular, and now that we have seen in general how the campaign unfolded. These two points involve two numbers.

The first number is 33,000. That, in ongoing alt-right mythology, is the number of e-mails deleted from her server by crooked Hillary to conceal God knows what criminal activity she conspired at while Secy of State. The Russians hadn’t hacked her server, that wasn’t the material on offer at the 6/9/16 meeting. But, if you follow the axiomatic, foundational belief that those 33k e-mails must have been deleted because they contained evidence of Hillary crookedness, and then add the just-as-reasonable postulate that at least some of this criminal conspiracy would have been with folks at the DNC, then it follows that the mound of stuff hacked from the DNC, the stuff that Veselnitskaya was offering, must contain at least some of these 33k lost, incriminating, e-mails.

At this point in his campaign, everyone, even Trump himself it would seem, believed that he needed some sort of Hail Mary pass, some sort of big event or revelation, to win, because by all conventional calculations, he was going to lose. He was behind in the polls, nationally and in the battleground states, and he lacked the means that, conventionally, would allow him to recover. The size of Clinton’s lead was never insurmountable – if he had some means to make headway, to chip away at her lead. But that was his problem, he had none of the conventional tools to achieve that. It was way late in the game, and he had practically no staff, no campaign, a mere 5 months before Election Day. People have remarked on the fact that having Trump Jr., Kushner and Manafort all at that meeting meant that basically the entire senior leadership of the campaign as of 6/9/16 was in that one room. The number 3 was actually a significant fraction of the entire campaign staff as of that date.

This consideration leads to our second number that Trump used in that 6/9/16 tweet, 823. He mocks Clinton for having 823 staff in her campaign at the time. The obvious point is the contrast with his own campaign organization on that day, some much smaller number, of which the 3 at the meeting would have been a big chunk. Yet, having heard the report of that 6/9/16 meeting, Trump believed that his piddling small campaign staff had completed that Hail Mary pass. He believed that his campaign would soon be in possession of the incriminating e-mails between her and people at the DNC that would give him an election he had no hope of winning in conventional terms. Her 823 staff was emblematic to Trump of her massive advantage in conventional terms, an advantage his pathetically small staff had just overcome by making a deal for the hacked DNC stuff.

Trump knew about the meeting with Veselnitskaya even before it took place because, at that time, getting his hands on the smoking gun missing e-mails was his leading strategy for winning in November. The 6/9/16 meeting wasn’t some Trump Jr sideshow. It was thought of by Trump himself as the main show, because those lost e-mails hidden in the DNC data dump were going to be his ticket to the White House. Manafort’s presence at the 6/9/16 meeting is telling, as it seems unlikely that he put any great store in this ridiculous idea that the 33k e-mails were deleted to hide a smoking gun that was going to save the campaign, and he would have been wary of the danger of getting anywhere near this material hacked by Russians. Manafort was only there because Trump told him to be there, and to keep Trump Jr from doing anything even more foolish than holding this meeting was all by itself.

And that is, indirectly, exactly how he did win. He never did put together a conventionally effective campaign. He continued to be a walking, talking gaffe generator. Manafort never could get him to pivot. Trump won because the Russian state security services ran a disinformation campaign for him.

There was, of course, no smoking gun e-mail found in that great mound of hacked DNC junk. The axiomatic belief that the 33k e-mails could only have been deleted because their content was criminal in nature, was always a pipe-dream. Nor was there anything else of actual, fact-based, general use in the vast hunk of hacked DNC e-mails. They were mostly about where to eat lunch. If you’re alt.right enough, if you start with the axiomatic belief that DNCers are criminals, even recurring plans to eat pizza at that place near DuPont Circle is proof that something monstrously criminal is afoot, so you drive to the pizza place with a gun to expose the child sex ring. But that degree of crazy is not a big enough demographic to win an election. Not yet, anyway.

However, the disinformation campaign that Russian state security ran for Trump after that 6/9/16 meeting, in exchange for his future repeal of sanctions, probably did deliver him his improbable victory. The micro-targeting of disinformation in key states and counties seems to have had its effect, though it isn’t clear if many individual disinformation messages relied at all on the hacked DNC junk. Russian state security is just good at disinformation, and so can be effective even without smoking gun material to work with. But the last gasp of the “lost e-mails” myth/disinformation may actually have been the decisive blow. The fact that apparently some e-mails between Clinton and Abedin ended up on Weiner’s laptop, and were thought initially to be “lost” emails from among the 33k, is what got Comey to intervene the week before the election.


#70

A list of Trumps tweets for June 7th:
Jun 7, 2016 10:59:25 PM Thank you California! #Trump2016 https://t.co/GusL2UPrX2 https://t.co/H6D25S1TR5 [Twitter for iPhone]
Jun 7, 2016 10:39:37 PM Thank you New Mexico! #Trump2016 https://t.co/wNOY8Pc2kM https://t.co/osWzVxNkJx [Twitter for iPhone]
Jun 7, 2016 10:32:02 PM Thank you South Dakota! #Trump2016 https://t.co/GbRTQdxIj4 https://t.co/pNqwOrY0ZB [Twitter for iPhone]
Jun 7, 2016 10:21:44 PM Thank you New Jersey! #Trump2016 https://t.co/PgIYkHLGtI https://t.co/MyJMOKdpJ9 [Twitter for iPhone]
Jun 7, 2016 10:12:29 PM Thank you Montana! #Trump2016 https://t.co/rOvTapLnWG https://t.co/PyHiy7vjO6 [Twitter for iPhone]
Jun 7, 2016 07:41:42 PM I will be speaking about our great journey to the Republican nomination at 9:00 P.M. The movement toward a country that WINS again continues [Twitter for Android]
Jun 7, 2016 06:52:38 PM I will be interviewed tonight on @seanhannity - Enjoy! 10:00 P.M. [Twitter for Android]
Jun 7, 2016 05:45:26 PM Thank you! Together we will #MakeAmericaGreatAgain! https://t.co/7Jk6voyzue [Twitter for iPhone]

The internet is wonderful and exposes fake crap people like you post.

Look it up before you post FAKE GARBAGE AND LEAVE OUT YOUR FAKE SOURCE.


#71

Could you post or link to that post for us to see… I can’t find it … H/T Louman

Again, I would like to see this ‘cryptic’ message that when placed next to current understanding tells us something.

Soo… I was looking for you to point out exactly what that hail mary pass was… What did he reveal to the electorate that changed their minds… Hillary had already exposed herself to the people who didn’t like her many years earlier. Her handling of the entire server situation, the operation of the Clinton Foundation and the Russian uranium deal were already in the mix. Of course you mean the actual release of the Assage obtained emails. This would have been Trumps big bang against Hillary… except of course we have some strong speculation that those DNC emails were not ‘hacked’ via the Internet and we have a potential inside guy who delivered them up…

As for the other ‘33000’ emails… a guy that was on their track turned up dead the other day…truly unfortunate timing but then again… no doubt coincidental… not unlike the many who seem to keel over in the Clinton’s wake…

I don’t see any more ‘hail mary’ from trump other than giving her a nick name of ‘Crooked Hillary’ and even at that it was no less speculative than saying Trump conspired with Putin to rig the election…


#72

I love the internet, there is real info out there if you take the time to look for it. Like all of Trumps tweets.


#73

Perhaps we can get patriot o move CT’s post to fake news.


#74

I think that Twitter ought to create a public searchable database for every one of their users…like Maxine Waters … Or Reid … Now… Schumer and Schiff might have some nuggets if one sifted through them. but… I will wait for @CriticalThinker to get back with that important information…


#75

LOL, Good one.

I can’t wait.


#76

Small correction: it was in a victory speech after clinching the nomination.

Here are the words Don used very bigly:

I am going to give a major speech on probably Monday of next week and we’re going to be discussing all of the things that have taken place with the Clintons. I think you’re going to find it very informative and very, very interesting.

Excellent research @CriticalThinker - I have some follow-up to share with this group. Even the ones who can’t manage the mental energy to provide an analytical approach and instead resort to “gotcha” tactics as is so often the case on the right.


#77

ROTFLMAO.

And nothing what so ever to do with the Russians unless you have a very good imagination.

As to your buddy Bucky chiming in, Gotcha tactics, how about fake posts???

If you and bubba would focus on why Hilly lost and repair the party, perhaps turn to a centrist platform you may win an election again.


#78

Everything he said in that speech was old news and going forward after successfully clinching the nomination of the Republican party would quite naturally be focused not on the other republican candidates but instead on Hillary and the many things we already knew about her corrupt nature. She already had a public record to talk BIGLY about. Any speech going forward, not specifically addressing policy would by its nature be focused on her and the democratic party.

Just the two paragraphs that preceded the quote you gave… all things we knew and all things that everyone, including Bernie supporters needed to hear, understand and internalize…

The Clintons have turned the politics of personal enrichment into an art form for themselves. They’ve made hundreds of millions of dollars selling access, selling favors, selling government contracts, and I mean hundreds of millions of dollars.

Secretary Clinton even did all of the work on a totally illegal private server. Something that how she’s getting away with nobody understands. Designed to keep her corrupt dealings out of the public record, putting the security of the entire country at risk, and a president in a corrupt system is totally protecting her. Not right.

Of course as you can note by the title of the article, the left were already being quite nit picky about everything and anything they could… this tripe is just a continuation…

Perhaps he had inside information of what Seth Rich was about to do… ? Now delving into that by being truly investigative and would answer a lot of questions… but I don’t think dems want to see what is under that rock because if Seth Rich is the actual leaker, as the analytical approach to the data transfer speed indicates an inside job suggests it might be, it exposes the entire Russia narrative for the distraction that it is intended to be.


#79

Even if it was from an unnamed fake news source.


#80

Yes, that speech was on 6/7/16, the day he clinched the nomination. So yes, speech instead of tweet, thanks for the correction, but the date, 4 days after the first, 6/3/16, Trump Jr e-mail about the upcoming meeting of 6/9/16 is right.

Trump was so focused on the “lost” e-mails containing a smoking gun that he was sure would give him the election, that he couldn’t fail to reference the idea in the speech in which he accepts victory in the nomination fight, even though the reference was lost on his audience at the time.