Lasting effects


#21

Well don’t hold him up as evidence, he doesn’t know what US law is let alone IL.


#22

Asylum seekers, ROTFLMAO.

When should they be returned to their home countries to help rebuild their nation???


#23

First of all… empathy should be reciprocated with a certain amount of humility. When illegals (no I will not refer to them as undocumented) come into our country and demonstrate in front of the White House demanding their rights while waving Mexican flags… I lose a certain amount of empathy.
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I really don’t see the loudest members of the open borders crowd showing up to sponsor these people guaranteeing that state funds will not be used to care for them… I don’t see these armwavers showing up with all of that wasted food that they are personally responsible for wasting… but I do here a lot of people telling me how and when I should be empathic. It has been show time after time that the right give more time, energy and money to community and worthwhile causes than do their liberal counterparts…

What I do see is an attempt by people who aren’t the least bit interested in preserving the culture and individual initiative that made America so prosperous.

You make the point of saying

Do we really want to be the great 1%er among nations?.. I’m not sure just why you would want a nation that staved off totalitarian governments of 3 counties… held Russia at bay and still managed to rebuild both Europe and Japan and arguably raise the living standards of just about every person on the planet. You really want to reduce our ability to take care of ourselves to equal with the rest?.. you really want to see what the culture of a third world country looks like?.. By the way, I am not part of the group that lives in a gated community that has armed protection 24/7… But one of those that tirelessly proclaim your right to self defense.

I have talking about this before but it bears a recap. Their is a town that straddles the US/Mexican border called Nogalas in the Sonoran desert. Long before any barriers went up on the border, the town essentially existed as one except for one important factor. Both sides had the same climate… the same environment the same relative culture and the same language. Their children played together and they went to the same churches… But economically the northern half of the town prospered while the southern half lagged behind. Property values to the north were higher than a neighbor across the street… The only difference between the two was law… and the importance of the rule of law over the more dictatorial and generally corrupt laws of man in Mexico… We already show Mexico the way… it is the Mexican people themselves without the will to force their own country into another direction… So, no, in todays condition migration isn’t the only or even the best answer…


#24

Oh…Yes… as a late thought, though relevant… I don’t have a problem with legal migration (it really should be geared to the needs and cultural alignments of our country)… my wife was one. It took a long time of standing in lines, having police home country police checks done… getting a medical exam that included an Xray for tuberculosis… She went through the process.

I don’t have a problem with people fleeing a war zone but I do have a problem not going to the nearest save countries… what to hell is a Bangladeshi doing trying to seek asylum in the US? Why is a Honduran not going to the much closer country of Panama or Costa Rica to escape violence… The narrative does not fool me… and using it does not fill me with empathy…


#25

Why single out our southern neighbors? Our policy should be to promote decent living conditions for ALL peoples…everywhere on the earth.

That does not mean we should give up our sovereignty or adherence to our laws.

Having compassion for others does not require that you invite them to come live with you. Nor does it excuse the government for forcing you to let them let them live in your community.


#26

Thanks for your thoughts, Scott. I really don’t disagree with your main points but I do feel that some of what you say is responsive to what you are reading between the lines of my statements. I am not advocating open borders, nor do I want to minimize the appeal of the US. What I am hoping to express is that pulling families apart is a harsh step to take, with deep and lasting consequences. We have found ways to handle challenges before that originated from our enlightened self-interest. We came up with the Marshall Plan, and I believe we can come up with a way to deal with border security that doesn’t include pulling infants from their mothers. Ideas welcome!


#27

I believe that the practice has ended.


#28

Are the people who brought the children to the US not responsible for their well being knowing that they may be separated?

US law is the problem. People entering the US expect a hearing before a judge. The problem is the number of people that take advantage of the law. So the way to has worked in the past is they are caught and are released with a court date. They seldom appear for the court date and disappear into the US.

How do you propose this be dealt with???


#29

The problem here is that their are some groups within the US who are intent on destroying the US border. Mexico passed out leaflets to people telling them how to ‘safely’ navigate the desert to the border (if this isn’t a government sanctioned invasion, I don’t know what is). The vast majority of the ‘children’ that show up at our borders are not accompanied by their parents… no one seems to be outraged that Mexican parents are sending their children hundreds of miles across a desert … for what… So that they can work (or be exploited) and send money back home to support their poor parents? You mention the enlightened thinking of the Marshall Plan… but you didn’t mention the industry that created the capital to finance that plan and of todays situation, you didn’t mention the 20 trillion of debt and a domestic unfunded liability of some 100 trillion dollars. Like I said, Mexico is its own problem and rather than bending to its own restless population, it sends them to us.

I have ask this question before but I guess as a general bit of discussion I will ask it again… Just how many people is the US required to take in? Is it a percent of US GDP verses the rest of the world or is it a percentage of landmass verse world population… a population I might add that has exploded because of programs like USAID… Or is it until the US looks and feels like its southern neighbors… we are already working to ignore laws that a minority do not like… Mexico operates that way…

Oh yes… one more point… why do these parents present themselves at the border with these young children anyway? Could it be that they are nothing but a necessary crutch in seeking asylum? Is it just a reverse form of sending their children alone to the border to attach themselves to Obama’s DACA scam?.. After a court has reviewed that applications of these people, it seems that 80% do not qualify… 80% and I am pretty certain that most of those parents knew their asylum claim was bogus in the first place.


#30

Discontinue interventionist foreign policies that sabotage efforts at democracy in deference to right wing dictatorships. Over a century of exploitation of the people and resources of many Latin American countries has been harmful to development. And there’s rumors that Venezuela could be the next country to suffer the hegemonic effects of US regime change. Where will the refugees show up from any conflict there? Probably at our border, and the same people that will support the war, will be bitching about more non English speaking immigrants crossing our border. :roll_eyes:


#31

There is a Republican congressman (maybe a former congressman) that has suggested just that. And the leaders of the NT countries did come to the US to meet with Obama and suggested the same, not by name.


#32

If only there were money to pay for a marshall plan.

But we need healthcare for all for freee.
We need welfare for all for freeeee.
We need UBI for all for freeeee.

Oh well with 21 T in debt some things will have to wait.


#33

Again with the acronyms… can you pleeeeeeeeas take the time to at least make them well known before you destroy your own post by using them. What are we talking here Northern Territories or Nastily Treated??

Late entry:… I FOUND IT IN ANOTHER POST BY SOMEONE ELSE… is it ‘Northern Triangle’ countries? Not only did they call it ‘Northern Triangle’ in parenthesis but they actually went on to name the countries… No guessing and easy to read.


#34

Monte likes to appear to be intelligent.


#35

It’s used in every news story and article written on the subject of immigrant asylum seekers from the northern triangle. I assumed you’d be well read on the subject that you’re debating. I do apologize.

NT=Northern Triangle of Honduras, El Salvador and Guatemala.


#36

Thank you… you use acronyms … a lot and I don’t really think that the reader should have to decypher a post just to understand what you are talking about… This world is full of acronyms… hell, its like college students being put out because they can’t use text speak on their essays…


#37

True, not all Americans are weepy suckers being played by the reconquistas and their sycophants in the media. Richest country on earth- for now anyway; if we open the borders it won’t be for long. You might be surprised that while we have been number one in producing trash, Mexico actually throws away more food. We have a giant military budget so other countries won’t mess with us. But we don’t readily accept every person who makes it across our border as a refugee. But of course you melodramatic phrasing has been duly noted, then ignored.


#38

You’re welcome. I’ve spelled it out a couple of times in the past and it’s used in many articles and news reports. It seems to be out there.


#39

And for a historical period too, and growing. California just passed up the U.K. to become the worlds fifth largest economy.


#40

False, the majority of it is used against countries that have not messed with us. And much more than our military budget is spent in wars that don’t come out of the Pentagon budget. Even Trump has pointed out 7 trillion dollars wasted WASTED in the Middle East since 9/11.